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Allen Iverson’s first game with ‘Cola: Half-empty or half-full?

November 17, 2010

L to R: Optimist BiE, BiE, Pessimist BiE

Allen Iverson’s first game in Europe is in the books – a disappointing 94-91 loss for his Beşiktaş Cola Turka, which blew a 17-point lead against KK Hemofarm Stada – and while not even the worst offenders of crimes against hyperbole in sportswriting are ready to ascribe any superlatives to Mr. Answer and his new team, one didn’t have to squint too hard while watching to imagine some glorious possibilities … or to dream up a disaster.

The optimistic angel on one of BallinEurope’s shoulders naturally saw things in diametric opposition to the demon on the other. The debate in turn centered on topics like the following.

• Iverson started but didn’t score until the second quarter.
Optimist: Hey, after going oh for three to start, the man ended up a respectable 4-of-7 from the floor to contribute 15 points. Plus, look at that first bucket: A.I. may have lost the proverbial step, but he’s still got some game left.

Pessimist: May have lost a step? “May” implies some sort of question is involved; why do you think no NBA or even Euroleague squad took a flier on him for 2010-11? It can’t all be about attitude can it? Plus, for a slasher like Iverson who creates with the ball, losing half a step might as well be losing a mile. Interestingly enough, take a look about 18 seconds into the second video embed below for Chatman – himself a fearless Iversonian-like driver – showing how it’s more commonly done in Europe: straight ahead through a soft pick along the perimeter of the lane. He misses the shot, but hey.

Optimist: A shot Iverson himself’ll be making, come January.

Pessimist: Is that January 2001? Will time travel be involved?

• But skills were still in evidence.
Optimist: Aside from grabbing three good defensive rebounds, Iverson appeared to come alive in the fourth quarter, nailing a long three and almost coming up with the key steal of the game (see about 30 seconds in on the video below).

Pessimist: The key word there: “almost.” Sure, if Iverson had somehow gained control of the slapped-away pass from Milivoje Bozovic, who really shouldn’t have been out at the point anyway, he might have sealed the deal and thus prevent the Hemofarm win. But one could only argue that Iverson was in position to make that particular play only because of his half-baked defense; but more on that below.

• Iverson’s okay interaction with teammates.
Pessimist: Wait, you’re going to start with an “all things considered” here, right?

Optimist: All things considered, Beşiktaş backers had to be thrilled that Iverson wasn’t completely disharmonious with a bunch of guys he met maybe a week ago. A.I.’s best play in Optimist BiE’s opinion? His first stat: The feed to Serhat Cetin for two on the early breakaway. Plus, the perimeter passing looked amazing at times.

Pessimist: Very brief times. Plus, Pessimist BiE just can’t help but continue worrying that Chatman’s touches are going to decrease. He definitely saw the ball less often in the Hemofarm game, particularly in the first half as so many plays went through the untested Iverson.

Optimist: But you gotta admit that the Chatman-Iverson duo might be something to see; and with so much going on outside, A.J. Oglivy was able to dominate the paint in ways that surely had him recalling youth ball with Team Australia.

Pessimist: Yeah, like Beşiktaş is gonna get a 20/12 every night out of A.J. Oglivy.

Optimist: Don’t be fatuous, Pessimist BiE.

• Beşiktaş blew a 17-point fourth-quarter lead and an 11-point lead with 3-1/2 minutes left.
Pessimist: Surely not even Optimist BiE can put a positive spin on this result. After leading throughout while simultaneously acclimatizing Iverson (and to some extent Chatman), Beşiktaş fans were suddenly stunned to realize that their side’s insurmountable lead had disappeared quicker than A.I. out of Memphis; see the picture-worth-1000-words shot of horror at 5.10 in the below video.

And while Optimist BiE will surely point out that Iverson was good for six points – Beşiktaş’ last six points during the monumental collapse, in fact – he also contributed an unnecessary foul plus one embarrassing turnover (see at just about 4.00 into the video below) that might’ve been Beşiktaş’ last gasp.

Watching the final run by Hemofarm also shows Iverson’s rustiness on the defensive end in this crucial period. Already forced into mismatches in man-to-man thanks to the greatly superior size of the Serbian side, Iverson played well too far off his man consistently, a tendency that haunted him and Beşiktaş in this final 3-1/2 minutes as Hemofarm picked and chose shots thanks to unmolested passing routes outside. You can’t blame many basketball losses on one guy, but Iverson did undeniably contribute to this loss.

Optimist: If this is as bad as it gets in Allen Iverson’s European Adventure, Beşiktaş fans have lots to be happy about; however, the new-look Eagles have got to jell quickly with a 0-1 start in a tough Eurocup group and a still-competitive 3-2 record in TBL ball. Plus, don’t forget that Beşiktaş already has the second-highest scoring offense in Turkey: This scheme is so crazy it just might work.

Pessimist: Ah, your momma’s got Ricky Rubio on her fantasy team…

Nov 17, 2010ballineurope
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This post was published on November 17, 2010
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Comments: 27
  1. John
    12 years ago

    Luckily for me, I did manage to watch the game on TV in Malaysia.

    From what I’ve seen, I think the Answer still looks a bit rusty and guess a few more games under his belt he will get into his very best. Nevertheless, apart from the loss, it wasn’t a bad start from him as made a few baskets and shots from the 3-point range.

    I also think that the coaches must also find a system that will enable him to flourish on the court. They have too, if they wish to see this deal succeed.

    Maybe it’s just me but seems like there was a few occasion that his teammate look reluctant to give him the ball. Hope there’s nothing bad going on back stage because with AI you’ll just never know. Anything can happen.

    With that said, can wait to see him in action again.

    ReplyCancel
  2. setrule
    12 years ago

    Hmm … interesting observations .. but that drive by Chatman while they were up .. by 11!!!
    without passing the BALL ???? that’s why he plays on this squad .(no dis) secondly A.I. did not give up those key 3 pointers (player #15) gave up 2 of them WHICH WERE NOT ON SCREEN PLAYS!! Clearly you can tell that Chatman and probably a few others on the team are a little SALTY which also describes the poor play . A.I., even if he has lost a step is playing with a bunch of college level guys at best .At 35 36 he will still do well .. give it until game 5 or 6 and we’ll see 30+ a game and most importantly WINS. Once again this is no dis to this great organization or to my brothers and sisters of Turkey. Long live A.I. !! Peace

    ReplyCancel
    • Os Davis
      12 years ago

      @ Setrule: Yeah, Chatman really fell apart vis-a-vis the game plan down the stretch as well. Between the turnovers and not allowing the offense to set itself in the half-court, the Besiktas guards really kinda gave the game away…

      ReplyCancel
    • Zoran
      12 years ago

      This post is incredibly STUPID. “College level guys”. The Eurocup is about 15 levels higher than the NCAA in terms of competition. Please take your racist xenophobic BS elsewhere.

      ReplyCancel
  3. setrule
    12 years ago

    @ Os > Spoken like a true basketball fan … they surely did not set up their half court game ..
    Could of should of is what armchair viewers say .. but some of it has to be blamed on the coaching staff .. Chatman probably has been given the green light to slash to the basket .. but like i said earlier it’s a reason why he plays on this squad . Are the stats available anywhere to view? I find this new experience into this realm exciting and i plan on watching games beyond this A.I. experiment .. once i figure it all out .. Peace

    ReplyCancel
    • Os Davis
      12 years ago

      @ SetRule: Stats for the Besiktas-Hemofarm game (and all the Eurocup games Besiktas plays in in future) can be seen at EurocupBasketball.com. Here’s the specific boxscore: http://www.eurocupbasketball.com/ulebcup/competition/results/showgame?gamecode=4

      Stats for Besiktas in Turkish league play can be found at www.tbl.org.tr, but very little of it is in English…

      ReplyCancel
  4. Zoran
    12 years ago

    Oh yeah, Iverson will average over 30 in the Eurocup according to you. Simply put you are another delusional NBA only fan that has zero knowledge about basic basketball. No one averages over 30 in any decent European league. NO ONE. NO ONE.

    I am so sick of all the ridiculous BS that NBA fans say about the game in Europe. it’s so incredibly ignorant, arrogant, xenophobic, and out of line.

    ReplyCancel
    • Gabe
      12 years ago

      Jeez, sounds like some people here have insecurity issues when discussing European basketball. I guess the USA being reigning world and Olympic champions will do that.

      ReplyCancel
  5. Zoran
    12 years ago

    If you want to follow the stats and games online this is the Eurocup site:

    http://eurocupbasketball.com/

    Also, you can use Eurobasket.com:

    http://www.eurobasket.com/Turkey/basketball.asp

    Here is the Turkish League in English:

    http://tblstat.net/

    if you really want to get interested in European basketball you will be interested in the Euroleague. This is Europe’s version of the NBA. And yes, it is about 50 gazillion times a higher level than you and every other NBA only fan thinks it is. it is ELITE, ELITE level basketball.

    http://www.euroleague.net/

    ReplyCancel
  6. setrule
    12 years ago

    I figured i would catch the old cliche’s whenever one is CRITICAL . Lets not get EMOTIONAL about my statement .. Let’s go over what was said . The team that A.I. has joined and the players on that TEAM .. I have watched enough and played enough to know that we (USA) LOST more than a zillion times in various stops around the world no matter what SPORT in WORLD competition!!! The HUMAN experience of agony and defeat or pain and joy exists beyond this hemisphere in the WEST.

    But since we are talking about Basketball i can name a grocery list of players abroad that are not in the ASSOCIATION anymore because they just did not pan out NOT because of skill level but simple POLITICS. If the NBA champion of each year played a WORLD championship game per se against whomever you deem ELITE i bet YOUR choice would probably WIN 5 OUT of 10 for sure. This has been well documented since 88 my friend remember Coach John Thompson with David Robinson , Dan Majerle , Mitch Richmond , etc lost to ELITE players and came up with the BRONZE .. so lets make a DREAM TEAM remember that ?? that goes without saying any further my friend. Sorry if you took offense but this Turkish squad with A.I. will not do well against the level of competition you and i know that’s playing in the EUROLEAGUE etc . Saying he would avg 30+ sounds really far off and silly but A.I. will def avg 18 to 25 a game with a pretty good shooting pct behind the arc and hopefully prove the doubters and naysayers wrong with some VINTAGE play.. Take care

    ps. My reference to college level here in the US is (no dis) Division 1 is no cakewalk either .. just saying this Turkish squad has the look of one IMO

    ReplyCancel
    • Apollo
      12 years ago

      If you believe that Eurocup players are “college level players at best” you should be banned from this site.

      ReplyCancel
      • Gabe
        12 years ago

        I think you should be banned from saying to ban someone. The leagues in order are.
        1. NBA
        2. Euroleague
        3. Eurocup
        4. NCAA
        Eurocup is not even the top league is Europe. Yes it is a little better than NCAA because NCAA is all kids but just as how some people believe that a top Euroleague team like FC Barcelona can be competitive in the NBA it is also possible for some people to believe that a top NCAA like Duke can be competitive in Eurocup.

        ReplyCancel
        • Mika
          12 years ago

          The Eurocup is a higher level than the D-League. NCAA isn’t even as good as the D-League is.

          The NBA is not in any way better than the Euroleague in terms of competition in this current time. The Cavs can’t even beat one of the worst (maybe even the worst Euroleague team) at home.

          The Lakers can’t even beat Barca at a neutral court site.

          People like Gabe are living 10 years in the past at least and are clearly xenophobic against any basketball league that is not American.

          ReplyCancel
          • Gabe
            12 years ago

            Hahahah people like Mika are living 50 years in the future. They are so delusional they think NBA and Euroleague are equal. He mentions the two games Euroleague teams won against NBA teams in the last 3 years. Of coarse they will win a few games. MLS teams win a few games against English Premier League as well. If NCAA played 50 games against NBA teams they would win one or two as well. The fact is that since 2003 NBA teams are 38-7 against Euroleague teams. Anyone who thinks the league are equal are delusional and should seek professional help.

            ReplyCancel
  7. PointyCircle
    12 years ago

    Heh, thanks for the Iverson clips. From the clips it seems like he just didn’t have his legs under him – no explosion when he jumped for that and 1; just kinda flipped it up. Also, on that deflection, it looks like the instincts are still there, the legs are just a half step slow to react. Still he looked pretty good out there. Once he gets his legs under him, Besiktas should have one hell of a show.

    I hope somebody can answer this for me as I’ve been an nba-only guy for a while now, but do they have an offensive foul/charge call in this league? Also, what about handchecking rules, are they similar to the nba of now or more like back in the day?

    ReplyCancel
  8. Mika
    12 years ago

    Of course there is an offensive charge foul rule. Hand checking is allowed. So is a pure zone defense. There is no defensive 3 seconds violation. You can also make contact with the ball above the rim as long as you go over the rim to do so.

    Other than that the court is shorter and narrower and the 3 point line is closer. it is 22 feet 2 inches and in NBA it is 23 feet 9 inches. However, the distance for the corner 3 point shot is the same in both Europe and NBA.

    ReplyCancel
  9. Mika
    12 years ago

    Gabe is making up LIES here as usual. I don;t understand why ballinEUROPE continues to allow so much typical BASHING against the game in Europe here from NBA only fans. It’s really ridiculous. The site needs to stop allowing the NBA only fans to flood this site with racist garbage.

    ReplyCancel
    • Gabe
      12 years ago

      Okay, now watch what you are saying Mika. Nothing I said are lies. Everything I said about the 38-7 record is true, you can look it up on wikipedia, I even made sure not to include the games NBA teams played against Eurocup and other non Euroleague teams. I am just stating pure facts that the NBA is a much better league than Euroleague. I like Euroleague, I think it is the 2nd best league in the world and as a basketball fan I like to follow it up. But even if I was telling lies (which I was not) I never mentioned anything about race, all I said is one league is better than antoher so before you call someone a racist please point to what exactly I said that made me a racist? Do you even know what that world means?

      ReplyCancel
      • Mika
        12 years ago

        You are the typical racist NBA fan. You don’t have anyone fooled. And no, what you said is not true. It’s a bunch of BS.

        ReplyCancel
        • Gabe
          12 years ago

          How am I racist and what have I said that is untrue?

          ReplyCancel
  10. setrule
    12 years ago

    Xenophobic , racist ???!!!!!!!! these sound so so WRONG my friend!! . What race of people was i speaking about?? I believe that TURKISH team is a mixture of HUMAN BEINGS from various locations? Lets stick to BASKETBALL and FACTS .. Vlade Divac , Arvydas Sabonis , Šarūnas Marčiulionis , Dražen Petrović , Detlef Schrempf , Rik Smits , Toni Kukoč , Dirk Nowitzki ,Yao Ming , Emanuel Ginóbili , Tony Parker , Carlos Delfino , Luis Scola , just to name a few have helped make the NBA the global marketing machine it is today . I know i went outside of EUROPE naming Yao and others but .. i’am suffering from Xenophobia right??

    Without these players the NBA would be terribly bland .. the acceptance of these so called STRANGERS in every NBA city has been DELIGHTFUL to SEE in my 20+ years of watching their careers as BASKETBALL players no matter if they were from Mars or Venus.They are plenty more to add but this is not a history lesson on NBA BASKETBALL or NBA PLAYERS .. I was talking about the team that A.I. is playing on !!! Please read over what i said thoroughly .. starting with my first entry Thanks and take care ..

    ReplyCancel
  11. sgran
    12 years ago

    Mika, you need to chill. Respect is earned, not argued for. Moreover, this is the Internet, a place where people enjoy a good discussion.

    ReplyCancel
  12. Michael Hylton
    12 years ago

    For all the Chatman Iverson haters out there that just after little of a couple weeks who are criticizing that the duo won’t excell. Continue to motivate them. Chemistry takes time. Its a coarse that even takes a semester at best in school. Don’t kid yourselves into thinking that two prolific combo gaurds will not come together. “Only a matter of time”

    ReplyCancel
  13. Phil
    12 years ago

    Let’s not kid ourselves. The NBA is still the top league in the world. Euroleague is much, much better than it was even 10 years ago. As far as Euroleague winning some exhibition games against NBA teams, it is exactly like Gabe said … MLS teams beat teams from superior leagues sometimes, too.

    I will say that, setting asides rule differences/way game is officiated differences, there are NBA teams who I think would definitely lose seven-game series to Euroleague teams. Yes, I’m talking about some of the youngest, worst NBA teams against some of the best, most experienced Euroleague teams. Still, that is a HUGE leap forward from the past.

    ReplyCancel
  14. Goran
    12 years ago

    These American NBA fans are delusional. The best Euroleague teams could beat any NBA team in a 7 game series except maybe the Lakers and the Celtics. The top 2-3 Euroleague teams could beat any other NBA team in a 7 game series besides those two.

    The opinions of American NBA fans are so inflated about the level of the NBA that it is absolutely laughable.

    ReplyCancel
    • Gabe
      12 years ago

      Goran is delusional. To think a Euroleague team could any NBA team except the Lakers and Celtic in a series is insane. The opinions of some Euroleague fans are so inflated about their second tier league it is pretty sad. Since 2003 Euroleague teams are 7-38 against NBA teams in exhibitions. The only Americans in Euroleague are ones who could not make the NBA. Most of the best international players play in the NBA too. Four out of five players of the all-tournament in the 2010 FIBA championship, including the MVP play in the NBA. The defending World and Olympic champion is made up of all NBA players. Linas Kleiza won the Alphonso Ford Trophy in Euroleague, in the NBA he is just a role player on a bad team. Anyone who believes the Euroleague is equal to NBA believes MLS is equal to the best leagues in Europe..in a world delusional. How did Juan Carlos Navarro and Co. do in the world championship without Gasol? 6th place. How did Serbia do with only one NBA player? 4th place.

      ReplyCancel
  15. KL
    12 years ago

    Allen Iverson did NOT lose that game. His team did not set up the half court offense.

    ReplyCancel
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12 years ago 28 Comments EuroLeague, MoreA.J. Ogilvy, Allen Iverson, Beşiktaş Cola Turka, EuroCup, KK Hemofarm Stada, Milivoje Bozovic, Mire Dejuan Chatman, Ricky Rubio, Serhat Cetin, TBL, Turkey
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